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	<title>Comments on: Leadership&#8217;s Future: If You Plan To Live Then Plan To Help</title>
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		<title>By: Miki Saxon</title>
		<link>http://www.leadershipturn.com/leaderships-future-if-you-plan-to-live-then-plan-to-help/comment-page-1/#comment-2144</link>
		<dc:creator>Miki Saxon</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 01 Mar 2009 21:52:10 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.leadershipturn.com/?p=1886#comment-2144</guid>
		<description>Hi Andrew, Not meaning to sound cynical, but give it time. An enormous number of Boomers dropped out, didn&#039;t care, ranted, rebelled, did drugs; then they got older, got married, got a mortgage, had kids and turned into their parents according to your generation, but not according to their parents. Now they are doing more volunteering, starting socially responsible companies and non-profits and again are out to change the world.

Youth is inherently selfish; I find it of much greater concern that the attitudes you&#039;ve noticed are traveling UP the generational chain. That scares the heck out of me.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hi Andrew, Not meaning to sound cynical, but give it time. An enormous number of Boomers dropped out, didn&#8217;t care, ranted, rebelled, did drugs; then they got older, got married, got a mortgage, had kids and turned into their parents according to your generation, but not according to their parents. Now they are doing more volunteering, starting socially responsible companies and non-profits and again are out to change the world.</p>
<p>Youth is inherently selfish; I find it of much greater concern that the attitudes you&#8217;ve noticed are traveling UP the generational chain. That scares the heck out of me.</p>
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		<title>By: Getting Out There &#171; Name: Andrew Gordon</title>
		<link>http://www.leadershipturn.com/leaderships-future-if-you-plan-to-live-then-plan-to-help/comment-page-1/#comment-2146</link>
		<dc:creator>Getting Out There &#171; Name: Andrew Gordon</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 27 Feb 2009 21:59:48 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.leadershipturn.com/?p=1886#comment-2146</guid>
		<description>[...] post was called,&#8221;Leadership&#8217;s Future: If you Plan to Live then Plan to Help.&#8221;  What followed was a very interesting discussion, learning about an OD-like company, and [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] post was called,&#8221;Leadership&#8217;s Future: If you Plan to Live then Plan to Help.&#8221;  What followed was a very interesting discussion, learning about an OD-like company, and [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Andrew</title>
		<link>http://www.leadershipturn.com/leaderships-future-if-you-plan-to-live-then-plan-to-help/comment-page-1/#comment-2145</link>
		<dc:creator>Andrew</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 27 Feb 2009 21:37:23 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.leadershipturn.com/?p=1886#comment-2145</guid>
		<description>RE: Students get out what they put into college: I definitely agree.  It always drove me crazy when as an undergrad, I&#039;d watch other students just sort of letting college float by them.  Many of these students were also the ones who would complaine that things weren&#039;t different/better.  The most frustrating part of this was when you&#039;d try to put on a fun event or create something to solve the problem they were describing, and it was like nothing was enough, they didn&#039;t care. By the time I graduated, I felt like I understood these kinds of cup is half-empty people a little bit better, but there was still the question of how do you get people like that TO care.  TO participate, or even further outside of the box, TO work on solving the problem themselves.

So, circling all the way back to where this conversation started... I don&#039;t know.  I feel like the rule of 80-20 rule is outdated.  At the time I attended my university, it felt more like 95% of the work/progress/effort was put in by 5% of the student body.  Perhaps that&#039;s how it&#039;ll be as my generation grows up.  Part of me wants to be optimistic and say, &quot;maybe that&#039;s enough,&quot; but a much larger part of me says, &quot;It can&#039;t be.  And even if it is, think of all the great things we could be doing if more people really took an interest in working on fixing our problems.&quot;

New Q: How do we motivate or teach college students to see their college experience differently?  How do we expand the possibilities they see during that time and beyond?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>RE: Students get out what they put into college: I definitely agree.  It always drove me crazy when as an undergrad, I&#8217;d watch other students just sort of letting college float by them.  Many of these students were also the ones who would complaine that things weren&#8217;t different/better.  The most frustrating part of this was when you&#8217;d try to put on a fun event or create something to solve the problem they were describing, and it was like nothing was enough, they didn&#8217;t care. By the time I graduated, I felt like I understood these kinds of cup is half-empty people a little bit better, but there was still the question of how do you get people like that TO care.  TO participate, or even further outside of the box, TO work on solving the problem themselves.</p>
<p>So, circling all the way back to where this conversation started&#8230; I don&#8217;t know.  I feel like the rule of 80-20 rule is outdated.  At the time I attended my university, it felt more like 95% of the work/progress/effort was put in by 5% of the student body.  Perhaps that&#8217;s how it&#8217;ll be as my generation grows up.  Part of me wants to be optimistic and say, &#8220;maybe that&#8217;s enough,&#8221; but a much larger part of me says, &#8220;It can&#8217;t be.  And even if it is, think of all the great things we could be doing if more people really took an interest in working on fixing our problems.&#8221;</p>
<p>New Q: How do we motivate or teach college students to see their college experience differently?  How do we expand the possibilities they see during that time and beyond?</p>
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		<title>By: Miki Saxon</title>
		<link>http://www.leadershipturn.com/leaderships-future-if-you-plan-to-live-then-plan-to-help/comment-page-1/#comment-2115</link>
		<dc:creator>Miki Saxon</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 27 Feb 2009 19:23:08 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.leadershipturn.com/?p=1886#comment-2115</guid>
		<description>Terrific article, I&#039;m going to use it and our conversation next Thursday. Thanks, Andrew!

Well, the younger generation always claims that the previous generation screwed everything up and the older generations claim that the younger ones are going to hell because they are different and have terrible music.  Such is history probably back to the caveman.

It&#039;s interesting that you say you started learning those lessons in college, I was told something similar about studying and learning by Jim Gordon, who draws &lt;a href=&quot;../category/my-generation/&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;mY generation&lt;/a&gt; at my other blog.

What the optimist in me hopes people learn in college is that they don&#039;t know it all, the value of learning, how to learn, that different is more often good than bad and that, occasionally, they discover a true passion that will last a lifetime. Unfortunately, my optimist is having a hard time staying optimistic. The reality is that you get out of school exactly what you put into it. If you see it only as a path to an MBA that&#039;s all it is; if you see it as a boring necessity, parental expectation or keeping your meal ticket an extra four years that&#039;s exactly what it will be.

In answer to your question I&#039;ve been doing relatively mellow rants on that subject on both blogs for the last few years. The short answer is parents instilling the &quot;I am special&quot; mentality in their little darlings by fighting their fights for them and an education system that tied funding to passing tests and graduating as opposed to learning.

If you want more of my thoughts on entitlement (not just in your generation) check &lt;a href=&quot;http://mappingcompanysuccess.com/?s=entitlement&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;here&lt;/a&gt; and &lt;a href=&quot;http://www.leadershipturn.com/?s=entitlement&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;here&lt;/a&gt;; you might also want to take a look at &lt;a href=&quot;http://www.leadershipturn.com/category/candidprof/&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;CandidProf&lt;/a&gt; for a view from the other side.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Terrific article, I&#8217;m going to use it and our conversation next Thursday. Thanks, Andrew!</p>
<p>Well, the younger generation always claims that the previous generation screwed everything up and the older generations claim that the younger ones are going to hell because they are different and have terrible music.  Such is history probably back to the caveman.</p>
<p>It&#8217;s interesting that you say you started learning those lessons in college, I was told something similar about studying and learning by Jim Gordon, who draws <a href="../category/my-generation/" rel="nofollow">mY generation</a> at my other blog.</p>
<p>What the optimist in me hopes people learn in college is that they don&#8217;t know it all, the value of learning, how to learn, that different is more often good than bad and that, occasionally, they discover a true passion that will last a lifetime. Unfortunately, my optimist is having a hard time staying optimistic. The reality is that you get out of school exactly what you put into it. If you see it only as a path to an MBA that&#8217;s all it is; if you see it as a boring necessity, parental expectation or keeping your meal ticket an extra four years that&#8217;s exactly what it will be.</p>
<p>In answer to your question I&#8217;ve been doing relatively mellow rants on that subject on both blogs for the last few years. The short answer is parents instilling the &#8220;I am special&#8221; mentality in their little darlings by fighting their fights for them and an education system that tied funding to passing tests and graduating as opposed to learning.</p>
<p>If you want more of my thoughts on entitlement (not just in your generation) check <a href="http://mappingcompanysuccess.com/?s=entitlement" rel="nofollow">here</a> and <a href="http://www.leadershipturn.com/?s=entitlement" rel="nofollow">here</a>; you might also want to take a look at <a href="http://www.leadershipturn.com/category/candidprof/" rel="nofollow">CandidProf</a> for a view from the other side.</p>
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		<title>By: Andrew</title>
		<link>http://www.leadershipturn.com/leaderships-future-if-you-plan-to-live-then-plan-to-help/comment-page-1/#comment-2128</link>
		<dc:creator>Andrew</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 27 Feb 2009 17:51:25 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.leadershipturn.com/?p=1886#comment-2128</guid>
		<description>I think the question you raise about what my generation plans to do is a good one.  You&#039;re right - my generation definitely has entitlement issues.  I read a really interesting NYT piece the other day about student expectations (http://www.nytimes.com/2009/02/18/education/18college.html) and I think it&#039;s really dead on.

Short answer: I don&#039;t know what we&#039;ll do about it.  Long answer: I don&#039;t know what we&#039;ll do about it, but I hope that realizations sink in soon that big changes require time, compromise is a vital skill, sometimes it doesn&#039;t matter that you put in effort if the output isn&#039;t there... these kinds of lessons.  

Heh, but according to your post, this may be pretty hard, considering changing behaviors and outlooks once in adulthood can be challenging.

I also want to add that many of these lessons I started learning as an undergrad through participation in a variety of student organizations I was either a part of or headed.  I sort of got through my classes, but put most of my time and energy into things outside my studies.  Which brings up a whole separate question: what are students really getting from their college education and is what they&#039;re receiving now best?  By pushing college students through so they can get a job (currently not guaranteed whatsoever), are we really preparing them with the lessons and experience they need to take on the current problems of their country and the WORLD?  The problems that are bigger than just getting through their work day?

I have a question for you, if I may ask: in your opinion, what factors contributed to my generation being impatient, cynical, entitled, etc.?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I think the question you raise about what my generation plans to do is a good one.  You&#8217;re right &#8211; my generation definitely has entitlement issues.  I read a really interesting NYT piece the other day about student expectations (<a href="http://www.nytimes.com/2009/02/18/education/18college.html" rel="nofollow">http://www.nytimes.com/2009/02/18/education/18college.html</a>) and I think it&#8217;s really dead on.</p>
<p>Short answer: I don&#8217;t know what we&#8217;ll do about it.  Long answer: I don&#8217;t know what we&#8217;ll do about it, but I hope that realizations sink in soon that big changes require time, compromise is a vital skill, sometimes it doesn&#8217;t matter that you put in effort if the output isn&#8217;t there&#8230; these kinds of lessons.  </p>
<p>Heh, but according to your post, this may be pretty hard, considering changing behaviors and outlooks once in adulthood can be challenging.</p>
<p>I also want to add that many of these lessons I started learning as an undergrad through participation in a variety of student organizations I was either a part of or headed.  I sort of got through my classes, but put most of my time and energy into things outside my studies.  Which brings up a whole separate question: what are students really getting from their college education and is what they&#8217;re receiving now best?  By pushing college students through so they can get a job (currently not guaranteed whatsoever), are we really preparing them with the lessons and experience they need to take on the current problems of their country and the WORLD?  The problems that are bigger than just getting through their work day?</p>
<p>I have a question for you, if I may ask: in your opinion, what factors contributed to my generation being impatient, cynical, entitled, etc.?</p>
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		<title>By: Miki Saxon</title>
		<link>http://www.leadershipturn.com/leaderships-future-if-you-plan-to-live-then-plan-to-help/comment-page-1/#comment-2127</link>
		<dc:creator>Miki Saxon</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 27 Feb 2009 17:28:10 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.leadershipturn.com/?p=1886#comment-2127</guid>
		<description>Hi Andrew, thanks for stopping by and thanks for the kind words. 

I agree in part with you, but what I wrote wasn&#039;t a statement focused on the current economic situation. Boom or bust, the cross generational attitude has been heavily focused on &#039;me&#039;.

But since you&#039;re here, I would like to ask you a question. Your generation (I checked out your blog:) claims that most of the fault for all this lies with previous generations (as they said about those that came before them), but I&#039;m wondering what a group that feels such a sense of entitlement, has no patience, demands instant gratification and claims to be cynical will do about it.

I don&#039;t mean that as a put down (except for the entitlement, which seems to be spreading across the entire population), just a description of publicly stated attitudes; I also realize that generalizations are dangerous and there are many who don&#039;t fit one or more of those adjectives.

Thanks again for taking time to add to the conversation and I sincerely hope that you continue to do so.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hi Andrew, thanks for stopping by and thanks for the kind words. </p>
<p>I agree in part with you, but what I wrote wasn&#8217;t a statement focused on the current economic situation. Boom or bust, the cross generational attitude has been heavily focused on &#8216;me&#8217;.</p>
<p>But since you&#8217;re here, I would like to ask you a question. Your generation (I checked out your blog:) claims that most of the fault for all this lies with previous generations (as they said about those that came before them), but I&#8217;m wondering what a group that feels such a sense of entitlement, has no patience, demands instant gratification and claims to be cynical will do about it.</p>
<p>I don&#8217;t mean that as a put down (except for the entitlement, which seems to be spreading across the entire population), just a description of publicly stated attitudes; I also realize that generalizations are dangerous and there are many who don&#8217;t fit one or more of those adjectives.</p>
<p>Thanks again for taking time to add to the conversation and I sincerely hope that you continue to do so.</p>
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		<title>By: Andrew</title>
		<link>http://www.leadershipturn.com/leaderships-future-if-you-plan-to-live-then-plan-to-help/comment-page-1/#comment-2121</link>
		<dc:creator>Andrew</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 27 Feb 2009 16:53:41 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.leadershipturn.com/?p=1886#comment-2121</guid>
		<description>Hi Miki.  Great post.  I think this level of social responsibility is something American culture doesn&#039;t really foster.  And, unfortunately, I think it&#039;s especially hard to ask people to help others when they&#039;re treading water themselves - sort of the tragic irony of tough times.  You&#039;re on point though.  People need to remember that the help the give to others now will come full circle down the road - and then some.  Thanks for sharing, this was a very interesting post!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hi Miki.  Great post.  I think this level of social responsibility is something American culture doesn&#8217;t really foster.  And, unfortunately, I think it&#8217;s especially hard to ask people to help others when they&#8217;re treading water themselves &#8211; sort of the tragic irony of tough times.  You&#8217;re on point though.  People need to remember that the help the give to others now will come full circle down the road &#8211; and then some.  Thanks for sharing, this was a very interesting post!</p>
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